I remember now. We were going to lease it and then CA decided to buy it outright because it was a better deal but there was a delay because we had two old printers that we needed to sell. I had thought it was 15k but then again tax.
The printer should have been bought per CA months ago but perhaps Roger got sick and other things happened. It shouldn’t count to the 50% because it was old debt.
Tonight we a decision based on the information we have for the planning future growth at the time of discussion the expansion wasn’t even anticipated.
We voted as a committee return the $19k now purchased printer and revisit the decision. That’s the point of action right now for creative arts.
What was the motivation behind the timing to place the order when it was? The minutes from that meeting say no motion was passed, can committees enter into long term contracts with no board approval?
6.3 Wide format printer lease to purchase (Kris Anderson for CA)
Kris said that CA had voted to buy the printer in full.
I’m searching for Creative Arts meeting minutes that record that vote. No luck so far.
I cannot answer questions to motivation. It was mentioned this was an outright purchase however it is not logged on my report from the bookkeeper yet.
I was able to cancel the sale. I called the rep after hours and he was very gracious.
Please send me his name. We will be buying a printer in the not so distant future and if he’s good I would like to give him the sale if at all possible.
You will need to get three quotes as per our committee rules like I did when we voted on it but I’m happy to give you his info.
Because this is such a huge amount of money at stake for DMS as a whole, we need to have a record of the cancelled sale. It will be placed on the wiki for record.
This type of large money I’m not willing to leave it to chance, a phone call, or without a record.
I can’t find this rule on the wiki. Can you share a link to where it’s posted?
Committee Responsibilities and Rules
Purchasing
- The Committee Chair may make purchases of supplies and/or tooling without Committee vote, for purchases in amounts less than $500, or 1/3 of the Committees total fund balance, whichever is smaller.
- Purchases for items exceeding $500 require a majority vote of the Committee at the next regularly scheduled Committee meeting, or at a duly called emergency meeting.
- The Chair/Vice Chair may exceed the $500 limit to effect repairs of highly utilized tooling.
I’m not seeing it either.
This is important to Laser.
We buy high dollar item tools.
The BoD was never asked to fund the printer, it was asked to lease the printer and have CA make the payments from their funds. Committees can not lease equipment, DMS the corporation is what executes the lease. The BoD did not want DMS to be obligated for the lease, generally DMS has not incurred debt that requires recurring payments beyond Rent. [1]
December 2017 BoD Lease Printer Agenda Item.
Wide format printer lease to purchase (Kris Anderson for CA)
Problem: the Epson wide format printers have been a problem to keep running and are taking up space while sitting idle.
Solution: Replace existing 2 Epsons with a new technology (selling), 64 inch HP latex printer and cutter. The committee would like to lease to own option of $526.98 per month for 48 months with a buyout option of $1 at the end of this time from Imagenet consulting. Imagenet has also agreed to stock the media we use as to save us storage space.
Relevance: This tool will be one of the most used in Creative Arts and will be structured so it helps pay for itself. The 64 inch printer uses a latex technology that heat cures the image onto the media of choice. Items that can be created range from car wraps, wall murals, cloth and of course banners and photo prints ranging from 12 to 64 inches wide. The cutter can be used with the media and with vinyl as well. The printer has a barcode technology that allows the user to repeat any jobs they would like as well as telling the cost the job will entail. Creative Arts is very excited about this and seeks the Board of Directors thumbs up.
The BoD declined to take any action so it neither funded or leased the printer. While proposed on the agenda there was no supporting motion or second so it died without any action taken.
Note:
[1] The MultiCam was purchased on installments but is the last item I’m aware of that we have purchased on payments. The Parts Washer was leased because it included a service contract and we believed included disposal of spent chemicals, turned out it didn’t so we purchased it. The Copier/Printer leased because it includes servicing. DMS rents month to month the high pressure cylinders for welding gases and CO2 for lasers - which is a standard industry practice as it allows cylinder swap outs at refill and we don’t have to maintain the hydro-testing. Beyond these items, I can’t really think of anything, there probably are several other items.
3 quotes is not a rule, but it’s definitely a suggestion we always push when making large purchases. It’s extremely important in a board meeting, because the board wants to make sure the purchase is reasonably researched, and we’re getting a good deal.
Thank you for the clarification. Three quotes is a good idea as a general rule, but as a specific rule would have caused problems for Laser, which has extenuating circumstances that I won’t derail the topic with.
In my opinion we still need a wide format printer We may want to wait until after
the expansion expenses are known to move forward on this
I don t care which committee takes possession of it, we still need it and a place
to put it I wonder if we should look at it like we do the regular printer
Size is one problem (other than cost) I wonder if placing it in the front work area would
work
Going to pose a problem & solution.
Am I correct in understanding that the last printers had one responsible person? I’ve heard @pandabob mentioned as former primary instructor and maintainer. A tool that requires such a significant investment in real estate and money, that is complicated & finicky & popular as a LFP…well… it sounds like it needs a dedicated SIG behind it. The CA Chair and committee are busy enough.
I was bowled over by the SIG representation at last night’s CA meeting. CA’s tool inventory is so diverse that their business model runs best on multiple SIG communities. A basic committee could not hope to supply the support needed for all those tools.
Just thinking aloud.
What follows is from @Nick Sainz not from me.
Will copy/pasta in its entirety.
Please tag him if you want to respond.
Hey, I’m trying to post a comment on the printer thread and it keeps giving me a error.
Thread:https://talk.dallasmakerspace.org/t/kris-please-post-the-sales-contract-for-the-hp-printer/42665/40
Could you Post the below for me?
You are nailing good points,
With the copier at first we had a lot of issues due to some bugs and every time we wanted support it seemed to start a 3 to 5 day timer.
The work flow went:
OR
As a person that work in printing and has leased equipment those kinds of shut downs are not acceptable. Most shops force the service provider to stock common replacement items onsite and require techs to come out same day as call. This drastically reduces the time it takes to get machines up and running during times of issue. Also, many shops require the ability to do their own support on the machine without the violation of any contract or warranty, again because of the cost of down time. Without these clauses in the contract, our service provider is not doing much more than we could do our selves with a good member and access to the manufacturers help line.
I’m going to ask that we split this topic to not detract from the original intent of seeing the now cancelled sales contract. I do believe discussion over the printer is important.
Just pushing this up with a reminder that we need that cancelled bill of sale for record. @Kriskat30