Front door security and proper protocol what REALLY are the rules

DMS General
1

More than once today I have been confronted with an awkward
situation at the front door and at the woodshop door. I was raised to
be polite and open and hold doors for others particularly ladies.

However this runs counter to making sure that the front door and other areas of makerspace are secure.

As I approached the front door today and used my card I had been
asked by someone approaching the door to LET THEM IN as they have NOT
BEEN GIVEN a card yet.

I told them I could not but would get someone tot he door to help them.

By the time I got someone of significance to the door someone else LET THEM IN

OK

Then today also I am leaving the woodshop area and a lady is at the
door. I open the door to leave and she says sheepishly I don;t have my
fob with me.

well how did she get in the building to then want access to another door inside the the facility

the gentleman side says be courteous, the membership side says she doesn’t have a fob to have access

so here are some questions

why are some arriving at makerspace without their fob or card and placing others in the awkward circumstance

why are others allowing them in even though they don’t have a FOB or card

is this encouraging people to be lax on bringing their fob or card with them thinking oh well someone will let me in

how many of these are real breaches

I am new and don’t know but a handful of people and in these two instances they were not people i knew

finally are there rules regarding this

are they enforced

or suggested

what do we really want to do in these instances

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2

I have had the same awkward situation happen to me several times. I do not let the person in unless I know them on a personal level and they have a legitimate excuse (i.e. I left my key chain in the workshop). If I have never met the person, I will not let them in. If they insist, I tell them that I will find a person with authority to come and help them. I honestly feel that if DMS members let people in on a frequent basis, then those who consistently “forget” their key fob or RFID cards will get encouraged to do it over and over again.

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3

That’s correct. If someone does not have their badge/fob and you are not in the position to know whether they should still have access, then please politely let them know that you will find someone who can help them. If no-one appears to be available, please send an e-mail to [email protected] and one of us will try to help. Thank you! :smile:

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Ok, so there are rules and there are the ways things work around DMS. The front door to the space is contentious. If I run into people coming to the front door that are not members but are coming for a class or meet up, I will just go and turn the unlock knob by the server room. This unlocks the front door for a period no longer than an hour and allows none members to enter and go to the public class. If I don’t recognize you I wouldn’t let you into the warehouse, unless I was able to guide you long enough to figure out if you knew what you were doing or not. That is how I handle this without feeling like an asshole, some members have higher standards and others have lower standards.

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I usually shake down the person for a few dollars…hehehehe…(JK).

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Would I be wrong to consider that our culture should stipulate that members blip their device EVERY entry so as to keep our door count numbers as true as possible? Even if someone is holding it open for you, blip your card to be counted. If you’re holding the door, expect to wait a sec. while they blip their card.
I know this topic went further, but if every member felt the need to be counted whether they NEED to unlock the door or not, it seems like the other stuff would get easier.

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Is that any different on Thursday’s at ~7pm for open house? How are visitors supposed to know what to do when they arrive for open house?

I was in that position yesterday. I joined DMS and paid online during the day and then arrived at around 6:50 for open house. When I arrived I could not enter because I did not have a FOB and no one there seemed to know what I was supposed to do. Someone let me in a few minutes later and I went into the lobby area. I knew that I needed to sign the waiver on the Kiosk, so I did so. But then I had no idea what to do. Other than signs confirming that open house was at 7pm on Thursdays, there wasn’t really any guidance.

What should the open house process be? How should noobs like me know what to do?

-Robert

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8

I let a young man in last night (after the montly members meeting) who wasn’t a member but was thinking of joining. He asked for a tour, so I gave him a tour, then escorted him back to the lobby. I don’t know if he left after that, though.

I hate leaving people out, too. Of course, during open house, the whole point is that non-members are allowed entry (though, access to the shop areas still requires signing the liability waver).

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So I think I get where the confusion is… the new member signup email is pretty vague. Maybe us, as a community, can redo it?

10

The short answer is there is piggybacking through the door systems, and there might always will be. We aren’t going to install mantraps or nothin.

There are no specific rules regarding the RFID door systems (the rules are worth a reading every once in while). It is a softer “house rules” policy to respect the door system.

Right now it does come down to individual discretion of members whether or not to open or allow others through (or not). And yes, we can all think of gratuitous offenders.

@kjposter, your actions seem to be good practice.

11

This would be a great reason for us to have photo plastic DMS badges. Not RFID ones unless we implement a 2 factor for the doors, but with membership getting past the point of being able to personally know all the members, it sure would be nice to have badges.

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Doug,

This would be a great reason for us to have photo plastic DMS badges.

That is a GREAT idea!

Not RFID ones unless we implement a 2 factor for the doors, but with
membership getting past the point of being able to personally know all
the members, it sure would be nice to have badges.

No need to do that if you get the card RFID entry option vs. the fob.

When I worked at the secured NSERL research lab at UTD, everyone had a Student ID card which was RFID active for opening doors and a separate photo badge for NSERL security. All you had to do was get a badge holder and put BOTH cards into one and then it was dual purpose. I always wore mine on my left jeans pocket.

JAG “Why Are You Staring at My Crotch?” MAN

13

Chalk me up for a “disagree” on the photo ID badge. Friggin’ HATE (yes, I intentionally use the word, and yes, it’s an activity) photo ID badges.
I understand the need, and comply when necessary, but rather enjoy the semi-anonymity that the 'Space allows. I hate to see the tranquility ruined by requiring photo ID. Next we’ll want them to be displayed at all times. Here’s a lanyard. Keep it out of the table saw!

Besides, already got at least 2 guv’ment issued photo IDs on me already if I need to prove who I am. don’t need another…

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A small computer system. Just like they do at LA Fitness. If you forget your membership card they simply look you up and see if you are you with a picture they took of you when you first signed up. Just have that right by the door, train a few key members or anyone really considering its just a search engine, and hope that people enforce it. I honestly think that would be the best way to go. There are other ideas that i came up with but infeel its over complicated. Like having members create their own personal 7 digit numeric code for entry when fobs are forgotten and such.

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I think that unless otherwise instructed and in lieu of a more complete re reading of the rules I will expect members that I dont recognize and in good standing to scan their badges even if hold the door for them as a courtesy. This will preserve the door count and assure me that I am not facilitating a breach of the building.

I also will not just let in the person who says I forgot my badge and in keeping with the excellence with one another dont expect someone to put me in the awkward position of letting them in this time

there are only three people that I know well enough that I could use discretion

16

Someone has to say it…

“Badges? We don’t need no stinking badges!”

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Nice one.

But you know, the badges do NOT necessarily have to have your name or your photo on them. Just a generic DMS logo will do. Or you can put your handle or another alias on there - I don’t care.

But Andrew MUST use his M&M avatar…

JAG “AKA JAGMAN” MAN

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The topic centers around people forgetting their key fob… now you want them to keep track of a second item?

:smirk:

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Jeremy,

The topic centers around people forgetting their key fob… now you want them to keep track of a
second item?

Have your reading comprehension skills completely deserted your Jedi ass?

Here, I will type it again but slowly this time:

Put… the… RFID card… and badge… in the same… holder… like… 1, I, ONE, UNO, etc. item… not two per my earlier comment about how we did things at NSERL. I can do a visual demonstration on YouTube if necessary.

Comprende?

JAG “Sarcasm Set To Medium High, It Is” MAN

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You think I go around reading everything?

I just look for opportunities to make smartass comments.

:laughing:

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