I’m from Stockholm Makerspace, in Sweden and we are right now renovating our metal workshop.
We have been considering getting an English Wheel, but we are a bit unclear on how much usage it would actually see.
We don’t have a ton of space (around 50m2 total in our 375m2 makerspace), so we want to make sure we get tools that will actually be used.
I saw that you have an english wheel in your workshop, and I was curious to see if you would like to share your experience with it?
For example:
How often is it used compared to other machines?
Can any beginner maker easily learn how to use it with just some youtube advice, or does it require significant instruction?
Does it fare well in a workshop that is not always perfectly clean?
Do you think it was a worthwhile thing to get in general?
Any examples of things people have made with it?
Attached our work-in-progress plan of the metal workshop, for any curious people :).
@Mrholthaus is likely in the best position to comment as to specifics of the acquisition of our English wheel, it’s general usage, and some projects or makes that have been done with it.
Speaking more generally, we’ve always tried to let the active and vocal users of a particular area (we call them “committees”, for some reason) guide what tools ultimately end up being acquired (or, on rare occasion, disposed of). These decisions are usually discussed in regularly scheduled and publicly announce committee meetings that are overseen by an (periodically) elected chairperson, and guided by typical constraints of floor space and costs, including opportunity cost.
And any large purchase usually, in fact virtually always, requires approval by our board of directors, who have ultimate financial responsibility for the organization.
So I’d suggest a similar approach for your metal shop area users. Questions should be posed like:
– “Is this floor space better used for some other purpose?”;
– “Where are the funds coming from for this tool and what will we not be able to purchase or do as a result?” (I assume it is not a donation?);
– “How many here have a specific need/project in the near term that this tool could be used for?”;
– “Who will volunteer to be responsible to manage the acquisition, install/set-up, maintenance, and teaching/instruction for it?” (assuming that volunteer considerations apply in your organization? e.g. No employees responsible for these activities?)
That’s a good-looking metal shop vision/plan. Best of luck :–)
This is James, the guy from the Dallas Makerspace who came out to visit you a couple years ago. It’s great to hear from you and see your plans!
@Mrholthaus (Max) and @TBJK (Tim) are probably our two most trusted resources when it comes to big tool purchases. They can probably provide great insight on the tools and the plan.
As one of Max’s students on the English wheel, I can say it easy to learn the basics, and while it can be a finger pincher, it’s still a fairly safe tool.
To add to what Marshall said, we now have a process where the committee chairperson has to provide an estimate of the value to the membership in either interest or attracting new members. @TJSmith is our secretary and can probably share the template and some insight on why it works for us. It’s been fairly instrumental in improving the effectiveness or upgrades we have done. Most recently with the launch of our new darkroom, where the costs have come very close to self funding the whole thing in a very short time.
I would say it not a great tool for us because the membership doesn’t really use it and it needs to be kept really clean but ours is always covered in metal dust or sawdust.
The people who use English wheels and other shaping tools the way they are supposed to be used is its own special community (the metal shaping community). Metalman Sweden (Per Lovgren) is the only Swede I know in the community but I’m sure there are more.
When I joined the Dallas Makerspace we already had a wheel. It’s not one I would have purchased. It’s a Chinese wheel manufactured for Baleigh industrial.
In Europe, you could get your hands on much better used metal shaping equipment than any new Chinese manufactured stuff. If you could get a used eckhold kraftformer, any Pullmax machine (Swedish company), or any cast iron frame English wheel would be much much better than ours. Or a power hammer from Yoder or pettingell. The reality is that sheet metal shaping is a master craft and requires a teacher. I’m the only one in our 2000 person membership who has even attempted to teach it and I’m not nearly as good as the people who taught me.
That said……you must have a metal brake and a shear both capable of 10-12 gauge material in your metalworking shop. These are basics (as necessary as a hammer). I would recommend these tools for sheet metal before any others
Thank you all so much for your input! It really helps a lot!
Looks like it will be a bad fit for our metal workshop in that case.
Hey! Great to see you remember us!
We are planning on getting one of those combination shear/brake/roller machines in the center of the room. Sadly, due to some limitations of this particular workshop (it’s in a wartime shelter, so there are rules that it needs to be possible to empty in 48 hours without too much specialized equipment), it’s hard for us to get the really big machines.
The one we are looking at right now will be able to bend 760mm wide sheets up to 1mm in thickness (mild steel). That’s gauge 19 if I read the tables correctly. Would love to get a beefier one, but they all seem to be too big or too heavy.
I would guess that most sheet metal bending is done with relatively thin (<=1mm) metal anyway? Or would you disagree? Personally, I’ve never done sheet metal work before.
We are also planning on getting an ArcDroid CNC plasma for our welding room. An iron worker machine hasn’t been in any plans, though. Never quite considered it before.
@TBJK Yes! We are trying to keep a lot of things on wheels.
Here’s a picture of us moving a 450kg CNC mill a few days ago. Had about 1mm of margin to the electrical cabinet, but it worked
If money isn’t the issue but space is an issue, fiber lasers would eliminate the need for ironworker or shear or a bandsaw….pretty much anything cutting related in metalwork. They are just really pricey and require a lot of power. I’m not sure what your metalworking goals are as a space. Those combination ones seem badly made. I would recommend just a decent box and pan brake and just use a plasma cutter or laser to cut. Slip rolls don’t get much use because they are for making cylinders and most people just want boxes
Anecdotal, but in a prior career I designed numerous sheet metal parts. Commonly called out for 18/16/14 ga cold-rolled-steel - 1.214, 1.518, and 1.897 mm respectively. Occasionally went as high as 10ga (3.416mm).
Is the hobbyist working with these gauges? I don’t know, but to the extent I’ve pondered personal sheet metal projects, 18 or 16ga have been considerations.
It really helps a lot!
