ECR Has an open track day coming up. I’ve seen a Lemons car on the track for one of these days in the past, so we might be able to register and do some shakedown laps coming up soon.
I doubt that they’ll get 6 sessions in, in a day so not everyone would be able to drive, plus they might not allow newbies on the track as the car doesn’t have an instructor’s seat/harness. To that end, does anyone want to look into installing a passenger seat and harness into the car so that we could do instructor ridealongs?
If you can convince the powers that be at ECR that you’re approved for solo runs, it’d be a good idea to get the car on the track and see if we have any lurking failure points.
Either way, I’d love to put a few laps on in the car.
I’ll probably register for my own car as well so that I can run all the sessions.
I think we are taking the approach that it would probably not be worth the effort to run the car at a track day before the event. We know the engine runs decently from last practice snow laps we did, and in theory nothing has changed since then. It would cost a lot (500) to install a second seat and harness, and we are currently waffling on if we want to spend 500 on new tires vs using the 2 year old but only slightly used primewells we have now.
I can understand not wanting to break the car before it’s primary race of the year, but I would think that something expendable such as tires, brake pads, rotors, fluids, wipers, etc would really come from a usage fee or something like that. There are expendable parts on the Laser and they charge $1 per 5 minutes. A race car will/should honestly have a similar cost per minute/mile.
Shouldn’t the goal should be to introduce people to racing and car stuff, not just a toy for 6 people to play with once a year? A second seat would add the ability for new drivers to have a go, with an instructor in the car, whether it be on a track day, a day that DMS would rent out from a facility or even just an AutoX that can probably be run nearly every weekend somewhere in the DFW area.
Also, I’m planning on running at the track day in my personal car and if DMS wants to get together for a car related event, this might be a good one to attend, even as just a spectator so that you can get an idea of what all is involved for a track day. Let me know if anyone is interested in coming!
That is a good question that goes towards what is the purpose of the car and why does DMS have a race car. The current model is DMS builds / keeps the car, and drivers work on the car and pay for all entry fees / consumables for a race weekend (I was referring to the 500 for tires coming from lemons drivers, but I might use DMS auto funds to buy more wheels). The goal is to educate members on building a race car and work together on a group project and be able to compete in actual racing. Having the car must contribute to our 501c3 goals, or it should no longer be partially funded by member dues.
After this coming lemons event the next texas lemons race wont be until next April, so if several members would like to organize taking the car to an autox or track day just to get more track experience we could certainly do that. In the past I haven’t been able to get much interest in members going out to autox events, and I would add I don’t think our 240sx would be any good at autox, sure it can make it around just fine, but it would place last in any class it would be eligible for, as its a really cheap race car with almost no performance improvements allowed for it to still pass lemons tech.
If the idea is to give newbies a chance to drive, winning at an AutoX won’t really be an issue, and there is no ‘winning’ at a track day
As a data point… http://www.hallettracing.net/rent-the-track/
Even at an ‘expensive weekend’ rate, you can run a lot of people around a track in a day, keeping the cost within reach of those who might really be interested.
For AutoX It’d run in a ‘race prepped’ class I’m pretty sure, but would really be a lot more competitive than you might think, being so light. I’d probably want to run my own car anyway, so at an AutoX day I’d be more support staff than driver. Giving someone that first taste of drive it like you stole it, can often be a bit enlightening, both towards a 'how cheap can I get a Miata", to the “I’ll stick to bumper to bumper traffic on 635 thank you”.
The biggest hurdles I see to really implementing this are a seat and the bigger issue of transport of the car.
Exposing new people to a track / competitive driving using our 240sx car does not sound like a good idea. Anyone can take their daily driver to an autox or track day if they want to try it out.
I believe the ECR track day you’re reading about (Nov 21) occurs after the upcoming Lemons race (Nov 14-15). The only other ECR track day I see between now and race day is a Lone Star BMW event.
Have fun at ECR! Just be forewarned that the track surface is very rough and patchy. I’d be nervous taking a daily driver up there. Be safe.
Disclaimer: I’m not on the DMS team, but I do race in Lemons.
Properly installing a seat was the most time consuming and expensive part of building our Lemon. We really wanted a passenger seat, but there’s no way to make it fit and be safe on track. $500 is probably enough to buy the basics (thinking at least $250 for the seat, another $150 for the harnesses, $50 for mounting, $75 for the padding, … it adds up). I’m budgeting at least $1200 for the next race seat I have to install.
Regarding AutoX, we did that once in our Lemons car. We set up our own little course on a closed street. The seat time really didn’t make a difference for us. The best thing we got out of it was practicing emergency egress. 12 minutes of AutoX is just not worth the hassle.
I wasn’t really thinking about the date i guess. You’re right on it being after the Lemons. I’ve done a number of days at ECR already, so I’m pretty familiar with how sketchy it is in a couple places (I’m looking at you turn 6). I agree that bringing a daily driver to just about any racetrack event is not recommended (Autox is generally OK) which is one of the reasons that it makes sense to me that the DMS car would be a good introduction to the sport. I agree that $500 is probably a bit low to install a seat.
To me, it’s neat that DMS owns a car, but it seems to be a bit of a waste to have an item of that scale owned and STORED by DMS that 6 people get to play with once a year.
I think you may have missed the point of DMS involvement with the lemons car. As an organization the Race Day is the destination. But as an organization Lemons is much more than a race day vehicle it is about the journey of turning a once street car into a race car. DMS focus is learning by doing and lemons gives Automotive the ability to take apart a car and put it together while learning throughout the process. If you are missing that I would challenge you to be at every build day to see what you are missing.
The last work done on the car was unadvertised to any post on the calendar, eventbrite, meetup or even just mentined here on talk, that I can find. I’ve been unable to attend most of the scheduled stuff due to timing conflicts (work and wife do come before racing in my book) but am excited for the opportunity in the future.
This will be the second race this year for the DMS racecar. The first was unfortunately snowed out. The DMS racecar may also be eligible for other series, such as Chump, WRL, and NASA Time Trials. Maybe with enough interest (and driver eligibility), the automotive chairperson would be willing to enter the DMS racecar into these series. Note though that other series have stricter experience requirements than Lemons (such as HPDE) and the racecar is a poor training tool compared to other options.
@Adam_Oas glad you’re interested in helping out. I’ve often been surprised how much I enjoy working on my car, learning new things, and going to the races, more than driving it.
Yeah, I know that things like the NASA time trials can be tough to get a spot at. I’m not wasn’t familiar with the WRL (until just now) but Chump I’d assume we’d qualify for.
I do enjoy turning a wrench for sure (even jumped in when Jay was trying to mate up his last transmission install, as I’d not done one before and had the free time!) but for me wrenching is both a journey and a means to an end.
FYI, I’m working on a ~$150 splitter for my car right now and from the general looks of the 240, it might benefit quite a bit from one, but it also appears to be a big pain to mount up properly.
I believe this is typically accomplished using heim joints. I’ve also heard of racecars suspending these rather than hard mounting them so that driving over curbing doesn’t destroy them. We planned on adding one to our racecar (note: not the DMS racecar), but I don’t think it’s going to happen this race. Instead we’re adding more missiles. Note that aero is holistic and the entire application must be considered. Adding downforce to the front without corresponding rear downforce can cause stability problems.
Yeah, I’ve never driven a 240sx, so I don’t really know it’s handling characteristics. With all the weight out of the rear, It’s really likely to need more rear aero help than front. Plus with inexperienced drivers, i’d rather set up for a tight car than loose.
