We got a new set of screwdrivers a few weeks ago in the metalshop. I noticed one already had the tip broken off, this can only happen by using it as a prybar.
Using a screwdriver as a prybar is not normal wear and tear, or an accident.
Handtools are provided as a convienience, the rest of us shouldn’t have to pay for your abuse. My first thought after seeing the brand new, but useless screwdriver was to lockup a complete set of tools to maintain metalshop equipment.
Whoever broke this screwdriver needs to replace it, came from Home Depot.
If its not replaced by next metalshop meeting a month from now we will have a discussion on what tools we need to maintain the equipment that will be locked, and what tools are needed to use the metalshop.
This puts me in mind of one of my earliest experiences here, like during first month or two, where some young guy asked me if we had an awl. I didn’t know but suggested he look over by hand tools area. The screwdriver collection was there as well…but no awl, apparently. I walked back around later for whatever reason to see he had decided to grind down a screwdriver to a point, and it was eminently clear how proud he was of himself that he had “hacked it!” to fit his purpose/need.
This is why we can’t have nice tools, a small fraction of the membership ruins it for the rest of us.
Someone tried to grind aluminum on one of our bench grinder wheels recently, anyone with the most basic knowledge knows you can’t “grind” non-ferrous metals, it just smears and gets embedded in the wheel, and can cause the wheel to explode.
Most people have enough sense to know when they should ask for help, a few think because they can flip a switch to power on a machine, they are qualifed to operate it. I thought the padlock to enable power to the bench grinders was overkill but I’m having second thoughts.
Luckily we only have two bench grinders so only all four of our wheels were gummed up, if at first you don’t succceed, try, try, try again.
Ugh!
About the aluminum thing, I would have no idea that was an issue other than learning about it on Talk.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable for the average person to know about the issues with grinding aluminum causing the issues it does, and am sure there are plenty of other examples of materials and techniques that go counter to what would seem to be normal unless having some basic levels of training/education.
We have a huge number of members who are total beginners in whatever it is they’re trying to do, and thus issues like this are always going to be a problem.
I’m not sure it’s always a knowledge issue; it’s an attitude. “My project reigns supreme”. Some members feel an entitlement to use whatever tools they want in whatever manner they want as long as they can accomplish their project; especially if they can accomplish it in a single visit.
I call it monkey brain. Its what happens when we get frustrated and grab the nearest wrench to use as a hammer because that it what is readily available. I know I am guilty of it from time to time. It seems to happen a lot with mechanical projects and disassembly. Screwdrivers become pry bars, wrenches become hammers. There are often better ways to do things but a lot of times we are either missing that specific tool or the member doesn’t know about it.
The woodshop posted it’s rules in the woodshop and “10 things you need to know” at each major tool. It helps, but it does not prevent really stupid stuff and won’t protect against the “entitled”. It’s also difficult to write enough rules to cover every situation. Last year some one got the blade of the miter saw stuck in a log and used a hammer to beat it out. Never thought to have a rule - “do not use hammer to remove log from miter saw”. Someone ran wood loaded with concrete that came off of concrete form on the jointer - never thought to have a rule banning wood used in concrete forms. I was a member for three years before I found out that there were rules. When I found out they existed, I looked for them and could not find them. Hence, I took it upon my self to post them in the woodshop and on the wiki.
What posting the rules does do - it helps newbies remember what is allowed and not allowed. Also - when someone is violating a rule - you can point to the rule. It also avoids (but does not eliminate) “made up” rules.
If I were woodshop chair (I’m not and I don’t want to be) I would automatically ban anyone who violated a posted rule for a min of 30 days (and maybe 90).
But we have to be careful - if you over police/punish abuse/damage/accidents - you may scare away lots of people and you may not have enough members. On the other hand, if you never address abuse/damage/accidents it’s going to cost a lot, machines will be down alot and you risk running off too many members because the tools are crappy/don’t work. It’s a very difficult balancing act to get right.
At that point you are hoping that people “see” signs. Although, signs are helpful so that the person that does read signs can point it out to the one that doesn’.t
I’ve worked enough retail and semi-retail things to know that some people just can’t see signs. Since the normal default in retail is “please buy my stuff”, I’ll read the sign to people without rubbing their nose in it. And, while I normally read every single letter in my field of vision, I’ve had a few signs escape my attention as well.
In a prior life chapter I taught a ton of folk how to troubleshoot problems. By and large these were capable, intelligent souls. Two key learnings came out of that experience.
First: teach what not to do. How they actually do something isn’t as important as not doing the wrong things.
Second: recognize that avoiding embarrassment is a huge human motivator.
I believe if the typical mistakes made on a machine were distilled down to something like “The Big Three Wrongs” and you post simple, but creative “Don’t Be This Maker” pictures at the machine … you will reap big benefits.
As an example, to follow up on the @dwolf concrete forms through the jointer example … post a picture/cartoon of a clueless maker getting ready to run a used cedar fence post on the jointer complete with nails, screws, dirt and a chunk of the the old concrete base. It’s over the top to make the point that metal, dirt, and rock like materials are a no no. Big caption at the top: “Just Don’t Do It”, small caption at the bottom “pristine wood only”.
My $0.02 (and probably just accept that screwdrivers are consumables at DMS).
I think it’s prudent to have a “committee maintenance” toolbox that is locked and reserved for that purpose, regardless of whether the prybar screwdriver is replaced.
I mean. It is a giant slotted screwdriver. Using them “as intended” in applications that require any significant application of torque invariably results in damage to the fastener, screwdriver, the surface the screw is going into, and naturally anything else that’s around because some weenie engineer - or worse, self-described “designer” (that probably didn’t receive near enough swirlies in their youth) - refused a proper self-centering screw head Because Reasons™. You’re not only increasing safety by rendering it unfit to use as a screwdriver but accelerating its inevitable journey towards the prybar it was always meant to be.
/s
I always laugh when I see a set of impact bits that have slotted drivers - there are safer ways to simultaneously get angry and chowder up an entire project without impacting down a slotted screw.
You should see what routinely happens to the pliers in the logistics toolbox - abominations that have been ground, bent, torched, welded on - sometimes all of the above.
They are not industrial quality but neither are we … . 2 of the adjunct instructors in the metal shop use these. A “floating” toolbox with all the instructor needs could be assembled. However, given the laisse faire nature of our work, WHO WILL BE RESPONSIBLE for stocking the cart and maintaining it? What will be the penalties for depleting the cart and not reporting it?
I am infuriated that there are no penalties for willful destruction of DMS properties but I will not risk my safety confronting violators without DMS support.
Best wishes,
Jim
“…risk my safety confronting violators…” Are we really to that point? Not to kum ba yah the moment, but if we’re is getting a response to a helpful intervention to prevent personal injury or damage to DMS property that’s anything other than gratefulness b/c they didn’t know better or embarrassment b/c they did, then either that member doesn’t belong here or our approach needs work. Being excellent to one another includes taking care of the toys so we can all play with them. I have to agree if they are causing damage b/c of abuse or misuse, they need to own up and come out of their pocket.
Caught a member hammering on the end of a Phillips in automotive the other day. I gently chided them. Then found them a punch. This issue is common in automotive. Parts are often rusted, broke off, stuck, pressed tightly… etc. the behavior can be corrected if automotive taught people how to properly deal with these situations that doesn’t involve beating things with a hammer. I will admit sometimes the only thing that works but that accounts for like 10% of the cases. I constantly see people at DMS using the wrong tool for the job. This is only corrected by showing them the right tool.