Revised HAAS Training Class

Machine Shop HAAS
#1

Revised HAAS Training Class progress. As some of you may know, I have been working on preparing a revised class curriculum for HAAS training (DMS members ONLY). The training is going to consist of two parts. Part 1, using Fusion 360 to CAM a domino 3D cad model for machining. Part 2 will cover the process and controls of using the HAAS to machine the part. This portion will emphasize the use of the training simulator to not only learn the controls but to be able to practice using them without requiring an authorized HAAS user to supervise.

As part of this process, I am changing the fixturing we will be using for machining the Domino. Below is a photo of the fixture I machined yesterday for this process. With the proposed process you will locate (G54) the rear left corner of the vice jaw and perform two setups.

First setup, will have the basic 2.5" x 1" x 0.5" block held in the left part of the fixture. In this set-up you will surface, contour, drill, pocket mill, then chamfer the top and sides of the domino.

Second setup, will occur with the machined domino portion being held in the right part of the fixture. You will surface the remaining raw material off, then chamfer.

Both setups will use the same G54 coordinates.

I will be hosting a teach the teachers session in a few weeks, where we will go over the material I have prepared, make any improvements we come up with. At that point anyone who is already certified on the HAAS will be able to teach the classes for certification.

IMG_1543.JPG3200Ă—2400 1.7 MB

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#2

Sounds Great!
As one of the old guard that never maid the domino, can we still sit in on the new class?
Thanks for working on this Walter

#3

This is a question for the chair. The sad fact is that we have no records of who had taken the previous class, and incomplete records for those who machined a domino… We only know which members have been authorized for independent access.

In my opinion, since the process is now completely different, including the recent tool crib changes by @rjohnsoniv everyone who isn’t currently certified should need to take the new class, including paying whatever charge the chair (@Photomancer) settles upon. But that is just my opinion.

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#4

I like the new jig.
I have made my domino but need to get up to speed on the new CAM. I currently use MasterCam X9 to generate G-code but I don’t think that’s going to be allowed as an acceptable CAM. I am willing to take the class again. thanks for your hard work.
-nick

#5

Everyone that paid to take the class previously should have a record of their payment (eventbrite registration). I think double paying would be horseshit for those of that paid to take it and completed the domino and never did anything else. The requirement of taking the new class makes good sense, though.

#6

Not sure if it matters, but I have a machined domino I can present as evidence of my completion of the original class. I would be interested in taking the new training to learn the new toolchain.

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#7

Folks, as I said, the process/price/etc… is up to the current Chair, @Photomancer

I stated my opinion above. The fact is that the process is now completely different. This will be an entirely new class. None of the material will be the same. In some ways (using Fusion 360) will be much easier then the prior FeatureCAM software; however, machining a domino will likely still only be the first step in the process. Like before you will likely need to design, and successfully machine at least one more part, under supervision to demonstrate that you are safe to leave with the tool on your own.

Which raises the idea that we NEED people to teach creating 3D cad modeling, preferably with Fusion 360, so that people can learn the hardest part of using the HAAS, designing your own parts…

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#8

ok, so lets put this in perspective here (and I hear your point completely) - Things to consider:

  • Did we get a new HAAS - No - so all the physical steps learned will carry over without issue. There are some newly additional steps required of those using the HAAS, but these will soon be displayed on the HAAS itself.

  • Can you take G-code created with our old FeatureCAM environment and run it on the HAAS - Yes/No - If you change the tooling in the G-code manually - YES - if you want to run it as is - NO - you are guaranteed to crash the HAAS.

  • Can you use the same process from FeatureCAM with Fusion360 / Solidworks / Inventor - NO - HSM is a different animal completely. There are some principals that will carry over - yes - however, you can’t do things the same way and it just work like nothing has changed.

  • If you made your domino, but never got cleared for unsupervised usage, could you pick up the changes easily and not attend the new class - why yes, it’s possible. Please get with one of the soon to be certified trainers and lets get you “tested” - HOWEVER - please don’t be offended if you don’t “pass” and you are asked to attend the class at whatever rate is decided by the Chair.

Long and Short - full price on the same material all over again is not what we’re saying here. Not at all. That I agree would be completely unfair. However, some fee for the NEW material, NEW process, NEW features is very fair I would think. If anyone feels like they have a grasps on the changes, has previously been through a class, and can show proficiency on the HAAS - Then lets get together to get your Domino made or look at your next step to get unsupervised access to the HAAS. OTHERWISE… I don’t see how going thru the class again for a lower fee is unfair to anyone.

My two cents here…
Thoughts?

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#9

As long as the fee IS lower.

I paid the fee, took the class, but never made the domino.

Since the fee is to support the machine, and I’ve never used the machine AT ALL, paying a significant portion of the fee again would not sit well.

I am not an expert by any means, but I do have some CAD skills. That’s not the steep side of the learning curve for me.

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#10

I’m all for taking the class and will do my best to make it in the first one offered.

I was stating my opinion to those of you deciding that having to pay the fee twice would be bullshit.

Edit: sorry, I actually called it horse shit. Up to you as to which one is worse.

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#11

@wandrson Thank you for working on this. While machine shop is one area I’m not largely familiar with, I have been wanting to learn the HAAS. I should be able to learn well enough to teach some Fusion360 classes to help out.

#12

Why?

Sounds like you didn’t follow through, and your knowledge was never reinforced. The instructor will have to spend a non-zero amount of time re-teaching you.

The fee also covers the instructor’s time, which is not free. As has been noted, Bryan was spending an ENORMOUS amount of time teaching the class AND doing the 1-on-1 domino test.

Fees for the HAAS are orders of magnitude less than what you’d be paying for SOMEONE ELSE to machine a part for you.

See above.

#13

The fee wouldn’t be going to be instructor, so I don’t understand the entirety of the post.

#14

My $0.02 on this point: I took Bryan’s 1st class and made my domino. However, most of that training is suffering from severe bit rot. I’ll be taking the class, at full price, to be trained on the new setup.

It’s a small expense for such great machining capability, the training helps me to not cause costly damage to the machine, and the fee is used to keep that spindle turning. I encourage others to do the same.

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#15

I don’t think that was ever decided, was it? Could instructors bill for class time?

If we considered only the honrarium, $50 for a multi-hour class with multiple students is a pittance. Those instructors who chose to instruct w/o taking either an Honorarium or some instructor fee are extremely generous people.

#16

I’m glad you want to do that. Previously, you could sit in any Haas class after having taken it to refresh your memory. The original cost is intended to help offset tooling and maintenance costs. The tooling and maintenance costs of the machine are relatively static (per unit hour of operation), and I see the updated class as no different than sitting in an old Haas class having forgotten everything.

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#17

And I just found the original class: $75 plus ~$3 transaction fee. Pfft, peanuts for what you are getting. Go try getting trained on a CNC for less than that.

#18

My experience has been the general policy for classes (long and require testing) like the Multi-Cam if you paid and took the class before you could sit in on a class, Bryan Gangwere also had this policy, which I support. That was before we had the new calendar system - so in order to reserve a space you’d have to pay.

I think it should be up to the instructor as to how many beyond the paid sign-ups will be taken as the instructor may want to control class size. So you’d need to contact the instructor to ask permission to attend as an unpaid member (who would have you show up and not go through calendar). You should probably show you paid for the first class as this isn’t a particularly cheap class and is used to raise funds for maintenance on this machine. If the instructor says your OK, I’m fine with it.

I support instructors in their ability to control their class size, not just in Machine Shop but any Makerspace class.

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#19

I can’t even tell what you’re arguing anymore.

#20

Sounds like a personal problem.