Obedience and Inquiry

Off Topic Maker Matters
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Here is something I ran across that I thought is valuable for any organization to struggle with in order for continued success.

The first rule is that you follow the rules.

That’s the mantra of the obedient organization. And there are many of them. You follow these rules, restrictions and systems. Not because they’re up-to-date, effective or correct, but because that’s what makes us who we are.

Obedience is its own reward. Obedience is required. And obedience is prized.

It ensures a reliable homogeneity, it gives the illusion of solidarity, it evokes power.

The alternative is an organization based on inquiry.

Do what’s right and ask useful questions.

This is a supple organization, one more likely to deal with change over time. It certainly has more raucous meetings, and it sometimes appears disorganized, but the resilience can pay off.

Obedient organizations get better when they find more obedient team members and enforce their systems on them. And organizations based on inquiry get better when they ask better questions, and when they create a culture based on what’s right, not merely what’s come before.

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It has been diminishing, but one of the classic meme’s of DMS was “Don’t make us make a rule…”

Unfortunately, as the numbers have increase, so has the ignorance…

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aaaaah memories… :angel:

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Walter, this makes me sad that this is how you feel when you look at DMS. But I understand frustration. You have always been so supportive of everything we’ve accomplished in CA and you have a strong grounding that I’ve never sensed this from you. I’ve always found you very easy to talk to and always in good humor and support when I confess my latest fumblings. Story time - my first year at Lewisville I expressed my frustration with my students to a true saint of a teacher - Sally Squibb-Csatari (google the woman and look at the awards and money she brings to students she’s a personal hero and a mentor) anyways…

I was beyond frustrated and I said “I just don’t know what to do, my students seem so stupid sometimes and I don’t know what to do”
She turned and with fire in her eyes she said “You ARE a TEACHER. TEACH THEM. It’s your JOB to stop stupidity from happening. Never speak ill of your students again. Never forget that the idea of stupid is in your mind and you’re the fool to just let it happen under your watch. Get your shit together and do your job.”
I needed to hear that. I probably need to hear it again. I probably need to get it tattooed on my chest backwards so I see it daily.

So this isn’t your job - but you are a leader here and you can change what you feel is happening.
I feel you would be a very good person to help with an new member orientation for DMS members - possibly leading them during the daytime. Just an idea. I would hate for this feeling to grow deeper and make you crusty. I think it’s important to connect with new members, know where questions are, try to help them out as possible and see the excitement that this place is to others and know you’re helping it grow - and I know you do this.

So ya, I’m sorry for getting all gross and sticky but I just think this place is so very important that it’s worth as much effort mental and physical to support it as we can personally afford. And yes, participate in correcting it and changing it as things come up. The last few days have seemed so toxic on talk and I’m not sure what we need to do to clean the water except step away from our computers and connect with individuals face to face.

Dang, I’m in a MOOD right now.

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I don’t believe you can change basic human behavior. And unfortunately, I am old and jaded, and believe what we have been seeing; people stealing (shrinkage), leaving messes, ignoring signs/rules/etc. is basic human nature. IMO, the only thing that can be done with a large organization is to create those ever increasing rules and to publically and with intent publically remonstrate those who can’t obey those rules.

As an example, whenever we have some new example of poor behavior someone invariably says, “We should have a sign to explain…”

Sorry, but I don’t believe adults should need (or expect) to have explained to them basic decent conduct…

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Dunbar’s Number came into play before I joined and its effects have intensified during my time here.

Essentially, the theory of Dunbar’s Number is how many individuals can you keep track of and truly relate to as human beings? Research done on primates has established parameters for their troop sizes based on brain features; apply the same rubric to humans and the number is around 150. This corresponds neatly to a well-understood organizational dynamic where cohesion breaks down around 120-150 people. Around that point enough of the group loses the ability to keep track of and know everyone and you can find yourself lost in a crowd; methods or organization that used to work begin to fail.

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The one thing humans have evolved to fight this base instinct is culture. I think this is what we’re lacking (and I do not know how to foster) in DMS as it stands. Remember when you were a kid (I presume) and you walked way from the dinner table, leaving your chair out, your dishes on the table, and crumbs where they fell? What happened? Your mom and dad told you to get your heiney back in there, clear your dishes, push in your chair, and sweep up your crumb because this is NOT A BARN!
These were the lessons which raised humans above their basal instincts; above animalistic behaviour. How do we get that here?
(I think I already have your input, re: castigation, which can certainly be a part of it.)
Peer pressure is the other major influence on youngsters, and I think would be the major force here. Simply make this behaviour culturally unacceptable; make them ashamed to behave this way. Don’t know how to get there, though…

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This is the crux, I think. If you see someone doing something in a way that deviates from what you’d consider the “acceptable” way, but not necessarily the “best” way, say something to them.

I recently confronted someone doing something really inappropriate with some equipment, and I did not back down when the member refuted my argument. It will be tough to do sometimes, but you’ve got to be polite, but firm, when trying to correct behavior that is not in the best interests of DMS.

</soapbox>

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Elect a new board that would approve Walter’s stocks for minor infractions and “old Sparky” for something more serious?

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I liked the part about better questions.

I think it’s a very thoughtful observation.

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One of our problems is size, Most folks will not leave a mess
in their sister s or friend s home, But that same person will
leave a mess in a store or other business place,

We can work on developing a culture that will be passed on,
I have seen that from being in the SCA,

Take leaving a mess, if you see someone doing that, ask “Can
I help you with this?” you don t have to do all the work, You can
put a tube of glue away or stand there with a paper towel to help wipe
off a table, They will be less likely to leave a mess next time.
there are always polite ways of getting folk to do things, Maybe
I am odd but the times I have been given a warning by cops seen
to ave done more to make me more careful than the tickers have,
tickets make me mad A warning sticks in my head,

If someone is usign a tool wrong, suggest that they use it right, so the
get the best results of their project, Make it about THEM not the rules.

And above all, remember that every one of us have a life outside
the space, you nefer knwo what is going on in someones life that is
distracting them and oftne times making them less nice to be around,

I will be honest, I stayed away part of the fall because I had too many
issues in my life to worry about any others, My hubbys strokes, my loss
of vision, a totaled van, severe money problem and learning to live with
disabilities made me not good company , and I still lack a lot of the patience
I use to have,

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12

Owen’s philosophy for 15 year-old millenials?

Reality is, anytime 2 or more life-forms get together to do anything, they will immediately begin establishing rules, because rules are necessary to get along without killing each other.

There can be no justice without rules. Only selfishness, self-interest, and immaturity.

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Only one rule is really needed…

Do what thou wilt, so long as it harms none, shall be the whole of the law…

But debate over that middle part is where the problems start…

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14

I would suggest, that a more relevent principle, is

Si vis pacem, para bellum .

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But only because you are a war mongering authoritarian, while I am a peace loving hippie!

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I think it is difficult to have a culture when our organization doesn’t really have a clear cut goal. I know we’re an educational non-profit, but that’s about it officially.

Also, how many members do we have now? A thousand plus, right? But think about the people you see at the space most often. It’s a much smaller number. Most of the membership in my opinion doesn’t want to participate in space policy or making a culture. DMS is a toolshed they pay to use.

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“Where there is no law, but every man does what is right in his own eyes, there is the least of real liberty.”

  • Brigadier General Henry Martyn Robert
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