Notice to all Welders & Plasma users - PPE provisions

Metal Shop
#21

Jast is right, sort of like religion. @FairieCyanide Here’s what I got, after another member had one I could try. Lots of options, but personal choice.

It’s no low end cheap like a HF nor $200-$300 high end pro helmets. But it is $100. Amzon says I got mine in April 2016 and I’ve been happy with it.

Relevant to this thread:

  • Meets ANSI Z87.1 Standards
  • Range settings: 4, 5-9, 9-13
  • Auto darkening, Not sure what the actual auto-darkening time is, but is is fast enough that I don’t get the “yellow dot” from the flash.
  • Has 4 sensors (5 is better, 3 gets dicey) important for TIG because it throws out less light to trigger auto-darkening

Why I like it - what I’d suggest looking for after tech specs met:

  • Helmet material makes it very light weight, lots of adjustment knobs - has large glass window
  • Head band adjustment; Rapid adjustment using a ratchet knob at back. Just put on a tighten. Easy
  • You can adjust the tightness that helmet flips down. Because it is light, you an adjust to stay in any position.
  • This model has grinding mode that makes it so it doesn’t darken if using when grinding (sparks don’t trigger it)
  • Has clip for “cheater” lens on inside. So don’t need to wear prescription. Picked the diopter size I needed at Metro Welding for around $5
  • My Miller close profile under helmet respirator P100 filters fits comfortably Sold out since Covid, replacement filters available directly through Miller. Other companies and models available.
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#22

Having used most main models from the major and minor manufactures over the last couple years teaching at DMS, I’d go Lincoln Electric or Miller, and not their lowest end tiers.

The Miller that Tim uses is “good enough”, I’d be able to weld with it without much trouble for 8 hours.

If you’re planning on TIG welding, you need to be a bit more picky with your helmet because lower amperage TIG you need some sensitivity adjustment to make sure helmet actually activates.

The two helmets I would look at (because I just did buy one :wink: )

Lincoln Electric Viking 3350
Lincoln Electric Viking 2450

If cost is an issue, the black version without fancy colors is typically $50 cheaper, and I bought mine lightly used on ebay for $150.

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#23

I am still bit confused. So please correct me if the following is incorrect. If I walk into the shop and use the bandsaw, I need Z87+U glasses but no shading is required? If I then go to the Dynatorch I would need to change to a Z87+U with #5 shading or better? And of course, if I use the welder, I need a good welding helmet.

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#24

Safety glasses are required at all times in the shop. We even require them under the welding helmets.

The only exception is if you trade out the safety glasses for the tinted safety glasses (5 shade or higher) for use with the Plasma.

Edit: We cover this in the welding safety now known as Hot Process Safety, which is a pre-req to all training required devices in the shop.

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#25

Some helmets meet the ANSI Z87.1 standards. Curious why would you require a second pair under the helmet but not two pair elsewhere? I.e. second pair under you plasma safety glasses.

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#26

Slag can and does go under helmets when welding. I’ve personally had a piece rest right above my eye on the edge of my glasses in that bay.

Shaded z87+U are only required on the plasma table since one typically does not wear a hood for the CNC plasma operation.
Everywhere else the glasses still need that +U rating for Arcflash purposes, but don’t need to be shaded. Arcflash here means it protects you from the incidental UV coming off walls/ceiling, and brief, momentary exposure through things like cracks in the curtains.

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#27

We cover it in the safety, but it’s mostly because of arcflash while the helmet is up. A lot of times you accidentally “flash” yourself when you’re not expecting it, and having the +U glasses on is the 50% solution to protecting your eyes. It ain’t great, but it’s better than the 0% solution.

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#28

Sounds like “yes, any U rating is acceptable”. Good question!

#29

I took that class about a month before COVID closed the space and I am cleared on MIG. I am still confused.

Sorry guys I misremembered this in the heat of the moment. People wore the safety glasses in class.

Why can no one simply say you need an Ansi U level 1-6 or multiple pairs of ANSI U glasses to do these things? It needs to be documented and spelled out clearly.

I have already bought expensive for me prescription safety glasses but was unaware of this need for ANSI U and I do not want to have to invest more than necessary. Sorry if I am coming across as irritated, but it seems like a big run around with no one able to give a definitive answer.

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#30

Who taught your class? It should have been covered, and it definitely should have been practiced during the MIG class as well.

It should be covered here: https://dallasmakerspace.org/w/images/f/fa/Metal_Shop_Safety_for_Hot_Processes.pdf in our safety slides. If they don’t make sense, let us know and we’ll change them.

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#31

I also want to know who taught your class. It’s a requirement that’s in the class material and supposed to be emphasized. Please PM me.

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#32

If this is the slide you are referring to it is not clear to me that you would have to wear safety glasses under your welding helmet. That maybe because I spent a semester at Eastfield and never wore safety glasses under my welding helmet so it would never cross my mind. Plus what is the level 1-6 for the z87 safety glasses for the plasma cutter you might want to include that here as well.

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#33

The general idea is that your instructor for this class, and your welding class, would hammer on that point a bit…

A fine point.

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#35

Key-word emphasised. I’ve encountered safety glasses that explicitly do not have any UV coverage whatsoever.
ANSI ratings for the pair will have a +U designation, often with a number for a specific level

#36

Also, people often flip the welding helmet up when not actively welding. The safety glasses worn under the welding helmet protect your Mk 1 Eyeballs during that interval.

#37

Option 1

These safety glasses from Amazon have z87.1 rating, UV protection, and side-eye protection. $15 for a dozen.

BISON LIFE Safety Glasses, One Size, Clear Protective Polycarbonate Lens, 12 per Box (1 box)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01G9J08Q6/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_18x8EbF4W4YSH

  • FULL COVERAGE PROTECTION: Full coverage UV and anti-scratch coating for the best protection. Built for all around visibility and a high level of direct and peripheral eye protection from flying particles or debris. Exceeds ANSI Z87.1 standards. Deep, universal-fit temples provides full brow and side protection equal to that of eye wear with large side shields

Option 2

These are over-the-glasses safety glasses. Pricier that the first link (~$20 for one pair). I’ve been using one pair of these for over a year and they’ve held up well.

NoCry Over-Glasses Safety Glasses - with Clear Anti-Scratch Wraparound Lenses, Adjustable Arms, Side Shields, UV400 Protection, ANSI Z87 & OSHA Certified (Black & Orange) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B071RSM598/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_Mky8Eb4N1YV20

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#38

Why are the tinted ones $7 less @$13 a pair? Lol. Thanks @HankCowdog . It’s good to know what works well over glasses.

#39

Is being ANSI tested z87 + UV OK?
Or do they actually have to be written on the lenses and certified.

The reason I’m asking is Oakleys are Z87 ansi tested in all cases. But only a few are certified and actually written on the lens which just raises the price for the same pair

https://www.safetyglassesusa.com/oakley-gascan.html

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#40

Has to bear the marking. We have enough people that try to just claim their glasses meet standards when just one look at them would say otherwise from someone knowledgeable. The problem is not everyone that sees them would know by examining them other than the marking.

Considering any member of metal and machine shop are allowed to ask another member to leave for a safety issue, it’s best to just have the ones with the actual marking.

As a side note, some vendors use “z87+” rather than writing out the full “z87+U/whatever” - since this is a common practice of manufactures since there are many endorsements for specific categories, often too many to list on the glasses, it’s considered reasonable.

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#41

This is absolutely one of those “what’s your favorite religion” kind of conversations, but for what it’s worth, I suggest that you get the welding helmet with the largest viewable area that you can afford.

Tim’s link is absolutely what many of the pros that only do MIG and Stick use, but for TIG and “finer” MIG work from us amateurs, I’ve found that the larger the viewing area, the better the performance.

This is the one I have:

https://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/Equipment/welding-gear/Pages/product.aspx?product=K3034-4(LincolnElectric)

Why did I pick it?

  1. It has a grind mode button - I’m not a great welder, but I’m one hell of a grinder!
  2. It has a huge viewing area, which I really appreciate from a situational awareness perspective. It also means I’m doing less random grabbing for the clamp that’s outside the viewing area of whatever I’m working on. The big viewing area also means I’m not putting it up and down constantly, which is a good thing for me.
  3. It was on sale - I think I paid about $200 for when I got it new ~3 years ago. After only having used cheap helmets in my past, holy cow. It’s amazing how nice a good one is.
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