I don’t even HAVE a DMS Tee. And I will mention DMS to whoever I please. DMS is a public entity. I may not pass myself off as an official representative of DMS (which I haven’t) but unless there was some ritual with a cat that I missed, the board is wildly overstepping its authority in attempting to stop me from verifying that Carrollton has some law on the books. So far… all I can figure is that checking the official stance at DMS displeases someone on the board. If you guys are that thin skinned I can’t fathom why you would even WANT to be on the board. And Yes, I am beginning to think the recently banned critics of the board may have had a point. If you want to accuse me of misconduct, you better have a damming video tape otherwise, I would appreciate you agreeing to just let me proceed, with these totally harmless inquiries, and cease this harassment. And while I would like this to be a peaceful end to this part of the discussion. I’ve asked politely but be advised, I don’t need permission.
You said it yourself; see:
You have flat out said you are asking about DMS with the City and what rules apply to us. That alone is a problem since we have designated people for this, and you are not one of them.
The reason for the rule is that the local officials were being bombarded by some DMS members; they do not appreciate the waste of time and wild goose chases. Someone even called in the fire marshal with a false complaint.
We are on thin ice with a lot of these groups, do not attempt to try and handle DMS matters with them.
The person who brought this rule to our attention is our GC for expansion and a licensed engineer who was made aware during recent talks with the city.
These are not harmless inquiries, these are actually causing problems when the city doesn’t have a single point of contact, information gets distorted by the non-experts and armchair lawyers, and they don’t like their time being wasted. We’ve already had “friendly” visits from the ATF, the fire marshal, and other entities as of the result of exactly what you are doing.
No, they definitely do have the authority to stop you from discussing DMS business with public officials. And given the crap that’s happened already in dealing with public officials there is plenty of good reason to have designated people handling it.
DMS may be a non-profit, but it is still a business. It is still appropriate to ask individuals without an understanding of these things to butt out and let the people actually handling it get it done. We have an engineer / GC who is the point of contact with the city, we have committee chairs already discussing options for the items that affect their areas, and we do not need members causing problems with the city and providing them with disparate information because what they have is not accurate.
The fact you brought powder coating up with it already shows you aren’t aware that powder coating was never prohibited at the space, only that it be done outside due to NFPA requirements. This already shows you are not in a position to even begin discussing this with the city if you don’t even know what rules have been imposed on us.
This; when someone’s actions are detrimental to the space expect it to be detrimental to their membership.
This rule has nothing to do with powder coat; our powder coating restrictions (that it be done outside) are because of NFPA, not because of the local rule that affects our spray painting. You’re already conflating different problems and this is one of the reasons we had to make a rule about members randomly deciding the onus was on them to talk with the AHJs.
This; this basically tells Carrollton that DMS, in a time when we are trying to clean up and pull permits, still had unchecked members that are pushing legal boundaries and causing trouble for the city.
This is not healthy for the space.
Try it. These accusations are such incredible tripe. Also, you totally misread. I’m not even going to respond. The membership can read through what I wrote and decide for themselves.
I understand your frustration, I really do. But saying stuff like that, and with tone like that, doesn’t make you one of the good guys. Just chill.
Some people’s actions have resulted in investigations by the BATF, and those persons may have been given a vacation from DMS. So you do you and do whatever you want, just don’t get us investigated or shut down. Ok?
You’ve already stated yourself you have been talking with TECQ about the makerspace on a matter you are not the designated representative.
Q.E.D.
I did not represent DMS… I gathered information to fact check what I was being told. Does not violate any DMS rules.
I understand the issue, however, nothing I do will cause any greater scrutiny of DSM than is already happening. Apparently, DSM has been a bad neighbor and the Carrollton police visited the other morning. Nothing to do with me… It appears they occasionally watch from an unmarked squad car according to another member. Might be because a few vehicles spend nights in the parking lot. Anyway, I intend to continue to find information and share it with the other members.
You were getting opinions on DMS specifically; you were representing DMS for practical purposes. DMS is not your personal home. If you went and asked about your home then so be it, but you asked specifically about the makerspace.
Given that you don’t have the background going into it this leaves inaccurate impressions on these officials as to our usage and needs, and is precisely the reason we don’t want random members calling up government officials about regulations that affect us.
Did you know that we’ve gone through 5 gallons of acetone in a 2 month span, just as metal shop? We had to get our own fire cabinet and lock it because it kept disappearing.
Did you tell them we can’t account for that? Because they now have an impression of whatever you told them regardless of accuracy.
and it wasn’t a neighbor, members / former members have been calling for one reason or another. One even put in a false fire marshal complaint under @Kriskat30 's name.
Let me reference this
Locally some years ago, a drug store next to a paint store in a strip center caught fire
The paint store then caught and several firemen went to the hospital
This evening I made something using one of our 3D printers. While in 3D Fab I noticed an extra large cup sitting on one of the tables. The cup was approximately half full of some random beverage. The ice had melted. The cup was room temperature. Clearly it had been sitting there for some time.
The cup was less than six feet from the trash can. In order to exit the room it is necessary to walk past the trash can. If our members cannot be bothered to carry their trash less than six feet on the way out the door there is no way we will be able to keep VOC records.
I have been through enough ethics courses to know that asking someone to ignore law is considered unethical. (I can chose to not be involved but agreeing to hide something is a problem). And when did I ever say I would mention DMS… ?
You obviously did not read what I wrote… I DID NOT REPRESENT MYSELF AS BEING AN OFFICIAL REPRESENTATIVE OF DMS!!! plus… I NEVER MENTIONED WHAT USAGE WE HAVE OF ACETONE OR ANY OTHER SUBSTANCE… . but if you are saying you have knowledge of unlawful usage… that’s on you… for your information… I NEVER MENTIONED DMS!
Did you mention this was in the context of a makerspace?
What other makerspaces exist within the Carrollton city limits that might ask similar questions?
What are the odds that they won’t presume that these questions relate to DMS?
The representative is in Houston… He never asked.where I was.
We should \be grateful that such representatives exist. His whole focus was to answer questions without assigning blame. He just wanted to help. I was wholly impressed with his professional attitude. Something the Space could use.
Next (accusation) Question?
Perhaps you’d like to calm down a bit before typing any more on the internet today.
This right here indicates you were talking about the makerspace.
You keep trying to justify de minimis and get opinions from them. You are not in a position to try and determine what we qualify as. You have repeatedly said you are talking with officials about makerspace, trying to find out what they would regulate us as which would mean you are giving them an idea about operations you apparently don’t know enough about.
Never said it is unlawful usage (though whomever was taking it for something other than powder coating is getting an earful when I find out),
@steve_a ignore this crap. That rule is a terrible one in the way it has been suggested to be used and should go away. It was written to hopefully catch me, but the issue that the BOD thought was me was actually another BOD member. As long as your name isn’t Nick it is likely many of the poorest written rules of DMS will never be aimed at you.
Good luck.
Good news, Having reviewed the Code of Conduct rules and specifically rule #5 I find that I am well within the limits imposed and in no way at odds with this rule. In fact, I took too many precautions and probably made myself sound like a fool. Oh well. Not the first time I sounded like a fool and will correct that in the future. There is bad news however. This is an easily manipulated rule and could be used to attempt to silence criticism, dissent or even simple disagreement. It could even be used to stop legitimate questioning if misapplied. While I have no objections to the particular wording, I suggest limits be placed on this rule to tidy up the possibility of misuse. Thanks to all who have pointed this out to me as I now have a much clearer understanding and actually, a bit more freedom as I proceed.