Micrometers are not C-clamps!

I was in the Machine Shop some time ago working on a project. There was limited space that was occupied by other Members projects.

I was doing lathe work, using a combination of personal Starrett and DMS tools. My only available area was the drill press table, which I cleaned and draped with new hop towels I had brought.

Then in comes this jerk working in the auto shop who needs to use the drill press. He sees me working, sees my project and tools. Does not ask if I could move my belongings so that he could use the drill press…no…that takes too much respect and common sense…this jerk carelessly grabbed everything and proceeded to throw it on another very dirty table in 1 lump. Yes…we had words.

I have witnessed many people using the auto shop coming into the machine shop. They usually leave messes and do not put tools or equipment away…I have cleaned up after them a few times!

I have said it before and I’ll say it again: Stanley Black and Decker ACCUPORT systems…we need to approach them for donation. 100% accountability.

While I will not excuse someone for not asking to move your stuff, I’m not sure using the drill press as a worktable was a good idea to begin with. I don’t think we should get in a habit of using tools as worktables.

THE POINT IS…all that person had to do was politely ask and I would have politely responded in kind by moving my belongings! THERE IS NO REASON FOR ANYONE TO DESPRESPECT DMS PROPERTY OR THE PROPERTY AND PROJECTS OF OTHERS!!

QUIT MAKING EXCUSES FOR DISRESPECTFUL BEHAVIOR!

1 Like

??? I said I’m not excusing them.

I hope you see the irony of this post.

8 Likes

It had to be someone who had absolutely no idea what it was. If you can read one you know how to use one. It is a shame this asset has been taken from a group due to ignorance. Perhaps a class in the care and feeding of precision measuring instruments is in order?? I don’t think this will stop the folks that are unaware they are ignorant but people like Contrarian may find it interesting and rather important if one is going to do almost anything in the machine shop.

I also agree with those who consider measuring devices to be very personal things so if these are replaced with HF junk I would care not as I would have brought my own anyway.

Throughout the space we are short of work tables and staging areas placed next to tools. It’s particularly difficult in the woodshop. Sometimes using a tool as a work table is a necessity. I hope we can improve that post-expansion.

4 Likes

It’s crazy how many in this thread don’t see it that way, and would rather blame Nick for “taking it away” by refusing to waste money (coming out of their dues!) on a replacement that would likely also be destroyed in short order.

Nick was asked by a group of people that appreciate and understand the importance and value of this equipment, to be the steward of the department . I would be surprised and disappointed if he were not more than a bit upset and frustrated by the destruction of these tools, no matter what the reason.

It is my observation that experience and the wisdom it brings are quite often the domain of what may be referred to as grumpy old guys. It would seem a good idea, if someone would like the benefit of this experience, they treat this individual with the respect they deserve. I support Nick and his actions and applaud his policy of non participation in discussions of this nature.

5 Likes

I totally understand this point. It is sometimes necessary for preparing things. I don’t know the circumstances in the instance presented but I do know that taking up a tool for extended period of time as a worktable shouldn’t be acceptable. For example, if I started using the table saw to glue up my pieces. Prep for a short time I think is fine and as you say, right now necessary but not for extended periods as it takes up the tool. And again, we need to get better at leaving notes and asking around before moving stuff.

Basic alternatives:

– Shop Stewards (people volunteered or hired, or both, to be available for questions, guidance/help, and enforcement of rules)

– RFID locks: put important, high value, and/or easily misused items behind scanable lock-outs.

– Folks have to bring their own…well, almost everything except the motor. But at least bring their own quality tools (e.g. micrometer) and accessories (e.g. router bits) if they want a quality outcome.

– Status quo: pretty much everything is considered a consumable and gets replaced when misused/abused/lost/“liberated”.

Or some reasonable combination of the above…they all have their pros and cons.

2 Likes

Restrict membership to those with 2 brain cells to rub together

Can’t Machine Shop do this already? “RFID padlocks” (is that a thing) on the toolboxes would solve a lot.

1 Like

I’m going to come out in support of rfid cabinet locks. I think this would solve a lot of the issues machine shop has experienced. Training gets you access. Also accountability in logging use and data from logs.

1 Like

DMS needs a policy of “users involved in the willful or ignorant (misuse) destruction of tools >$50 are responsible for the repair, replacement, and/or recalibration of the tool”

When folks see how much some of these Starrett tools cost it will be a pricey lesson for them.

1 Like

There is a huge difference between willful and ignorant. Making people ‘pay’ isn’t a good policy. You would literally have to have a trial of some kind with witnesses and everything to prove not just that someone broke something but what was going on in their head at the time. And such an accused person could just quit DMS and challenge any charges put on their credit cards or worse, sue DMS. I think these policies are new member unfriendly and reinforce and entrench the fiefdoms. It puts DMS in danger of changing from a teaching and learning culture into a blaming, punishing and defending our turf culture.

2 Likes

No… It’s simply saying whether you intended to (willful) or didn’t intend to (ignorant) you still damaged a tool > $50. Pay up to repair, replace, or recalibrate it.

It’s not mean and there’s no malicious intent behind it. It’s just like saying if you trip the saw stop with something other than your finger you pay for the cartridge, but not specifically laying out 100s of rules like ‘don’t use calipers as clamps’

We can’t teach if our tools are being destroyed from people that clearly don’t care for other people’s things.

If you don’t know how to use a tool stop and ask, or look up the manual. Using it anyway is just reckless and worthy of being required to replace the tool if you break it.

Never use a drill before and break some bits due to not being used to it? that’s fine, go grab another bit and learn from the mistake.
Never use a drill before and assume you can chuck it to anything and rip something else apart that wasn’t meant to be hooked to a drill, not cool.

So if you start to use a tool and it suddenly breaks due to serious abuse from the previous user, you’re stuck.

How about this then. One could argue that too many users cause unnecessary stress and wear on tools because they are at DMS and using such tools all the time. DMS should institute a reasonable time policy that says no user can basically use DMS as their workplace, be there every day or nearly so and or use any DMS tools for the explicit purpose of making something to sell commercially. I suggest no user can use DMS more than eight (8) hours per week or be faced with excess wear and usage charges of say $10 /hour. We’ve got to stop DMS from being used mainly by the few at the expense of the many. :wink:

Some rules make sense but that part about determining when someone ‘clearly doesn’t care’ is rather subjective and judgmental.