Build a Motorcycle or a?

For a personal project, whatever floats your boat would probably be great. But for motorsports, I would suggest something different:

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One of the biggest issues with the Lemons car, is the huge barrier to entry for actually racing and driving it. I think the Board has made it clear, that we’re not interested in financing a racing team, we’re interested in opportunities with a much lower barrier to entry, at least for the driving aspect.

Shifter karts are bloody fast, highly competitive, and far far easier and cheaper to learn to drive. A very large number of professional racers started out in Karting, and shifter karts are the adult version of a go-cart. They can easily achieve speeds of 120mph+, and with your butt a half-inch off the ground, 120 is FAST. The Lemons car is a complete pig by comparison.

Its cheap too. There are lots of used karts on the market, and they can be built from scratch as well. The amount we spent on a single Lemons race, would buy a kart outright. There are two Kart tracks nearby, and the cost to race and practice is vastly cheaper as well. Cheap enough that new drivers could get on the track very quickly.

How much faster is a Ferrari than a good Kart? How much faster is a Ferrari than the Nissan?

Shifter Kart vs. Ferrari (race starts a minute or so in)

Racing at North Texas Karting

If you’re gonna race, GO FAST! :slight_smile:

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I was debating a hayabusa powered cart earlier this year. One of the videos I saw in the comments they couldn’t find tires rated for the capable speed.

All about the power to weight ratio and willingness to die quickly!

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Shifter karts are probably a bit much for beginners. We would probably be able to get more new racers started on a single speed kart.

So…
Are the hurdles to get into karting actually lower than LeMons?
Especially considering there is already a car, whereas the kart would be starting from scratch?

Of course, there’s always SCCA/Autocross, which I think truly has the lowest hurdles for the everyday wannabe racer…

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Can the Lemons car be used for autocross during the Lemons off season.
It could be the practical application to the classroom aspect of performance driving(first proposed some time ago).
I’m still game to teach the class and there are enough speedy drivers on the Lemons team that can give their inputs.

The race fees alone for Lemons are huge. Re, the $2500-odd we allocated for a single race. Some parts n there too, but the driver fees, insurance, etc were pretty steep, because of the track used.

Hence the question re: is karting actually cheaper. It SOUNDS cheap until you start trying to do it…

As far as I know, it could.
Also, nothing says YOU (generic YOU) have to drive IT at an SCCA autocross. YOU could just support its being there, and drive your own car.

I know it pre-dates me to DMS, but has, for some reason, yet to be done…
Lack of coordination amongst interested volunteers, I think.

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Operating costs for karting are substantially lower than road racing cars. Whether it would be worth the initial investment is the real question. That mostly depends on the number of people interested in participating, and of those, those that would actually be active enough to keep a program running.

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I’ll remain skeptical, but presume that you hold much more knowledge of these topics than I. If I were in a position to yay or nay starting up a karting program in lieu of keeping the existing car, I’d want to see some numbers (and likely expend more energy on my own research than I’m willing to do now).

I’m just throwing it out there as a potentially fun way to get more people involved in driving, and in motorsports in general. I agree, that participation is the big “driver”.

If you’ve been listening at Board meetings, we’ve sounded the warning twice - we’re not going to continue paying lots of money, for just a couple of people to race. We want more participation. Working on the car is fine, but then people can work on junkers and learn too - for a lot less money.

This is one way to do it, and I’m sure there are others. But “no change” is probably not going to continue getting funded. So looking at alternatives is a good idea.

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If I build one, it will have a nice driver cage.

With signature Tim spot welds!

I have a set of plans (you may already have them) for an adjustable frame jig. A few of the pieces could be done on the plasma and with your lathe skills, I think you could maybe make the neck cones. The rest is just square cuts on angle and square tubing.

I’m thinking maybe about $200 or so in steel?

If you would like to look at the plans, let me know and I’ll PM them to you.